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Queen Opens Dutch Parliament
Queen Opens Dutch Parliament With royal pomp the Queen and her three daughters ride to the Hall of the Knights to open the States-General, the Parliament of The Netherlands. Queen in Royal Gold Coach. Crowd, few people holding umbrellas. Queen and royal daughters ride in open carriage, escorted by guards. Ext building that looks like church. Interior of parliament, members seated. Queen seated on throne, giving speech (no nat sound). Daughters seated beside her. Parliament members rise to their feet, and give three cheers to the Queen.
August 4, 1994 - Part 8
(17:30:16) Senator BOXER. All right. Now, I want to tell you why this is SO important because the picture that is being painted over here about this White House is that the wagon circled around this man, made him sweat. He thought a lot about this, he came in ready to recuse himself although he said he did not state that, and no one that. I know of said that he stated he planned to recuse himself. And then he was struck with guilt, collapsed sometime during the night, got up the next morning, made a call to either you or Maggie Williams-that's not clear at this time-asked that a meeting be set up. And what we know now about that so-called meeting is that peo- ple were standing around in, I think Maggie Williams office; is that correct, Mr. Ickes, as you remember it? Mr. ICKES. I think there are different recollections as to when that meeting took place. I recall having a very brief conversation with Mr, Altman-and I think Ms. Williams was present. I don't recall anyone else being present-in which Mr. Altman informed the two of us, assuming Ms. Williams was there and I think she was, that he had decided not to recuse himself It was a very short, it was less than a minute, Senator Boxer, as far as I recall. Senator BOXER. I must talk about this meeting because we're trying to piece this together. Mr. ICKES. I understand. Senator BOXER. And I appreciate your helping us do it. You remember the meeting to be a minute, someone else said 10 and someone else said 30 seconds. Do you remember-this is important. If you have a picture in your mind whether people were sitting down at that meeting, were people standing, do you have a recollection of that? Mr. ICKES. My recollection, Senator Boxer, and I could be wrong on this, but my best recollection is that that meeting, so-called meeting, the three of us were standing up. I recall it being in or very near Ms. Williams' West Wing office on the second floor. I re- call only the three of us there, at least in that conversation. And as I said, the three of us were standing and Mr. Altman told us that lie, in a very matter of fact way, he decided that he was not going to recuse himself. Senator BOXER. OK. So Mr. Altman did not, to the best of your memory, say I've got great news for you, Harold, and I want you to request and tell the President. I have wonderful news for YOU? Maggie, I am not recusing myself. Mr. ICKES. I have no recollection of that whatsoever. Senator BOXER, He didn't bring a bottle of champagne and say let's go out and celebrate, I'm staying on the case? Mr. ICKES. No, he did not. It was a very matter of fact, I would say less than a minute conversation and there was no follow UP conversation about it that I recall whatsoever. Senator BOXER. How did you respond to him at that time when he made that Mr. ICKES. I'm not even sure I responded. I don't recall making any response because I don't think a response was warrant 387 was up to him,, he made a decision, he came and informed us. As far as I was concerned, that was it. Senator BOXER. All right. I want to ask you, Mr. Stephanopoulos and Mr. Ickes, about the call regarding Jay Stephens. And let me start by noting, Mr. Stephanopoulos, that according to an article that appeared in The Post on April 2, 1994, no less than Marlin Fitzwater, Press Secretary to former President Bush, a leading Republican in the country, defended your telephone manner. Mr. Fitzwater said that your reaction to the hiring of Mr. Stephens was "pretty normal." Fitzwater went on: I have to admit that if you stand in George Stephanopoulos' shoes, It would be a little difficult not to be surprised and outraged by that appointment, The same article quotes Congressman Jim Leach, the Iowa Republican who is leading the Whitewater charge over on the other side. He characterizes your call as "pretty natural." Now, on these calls, did the President direct either of you to make those calls or contacts? I'd ask each of you that question. Mr. STEPHANOPOULOS. Absolutely not, Senator BOXER. Mr. Ickes? Mr. ICKES. No. Senator BOXER. To your knowledge, did the President have prior knowledge of your contacts? Mr. STEPHANOPOULOS. No. Mr. ICKES. No. Senator BOXER. The Independent Counsel stated "the evidence is insufficient to establish that anyone within the White House or the Department of Treasury acted with the intent to corruptly influence an RTC investigation." Do you have knowledge or information that would contradict that conclusion, Mr. Lindsey? Mr. LINDSEY. No, ma'am. Senator BOXER. Mr. Podesta? Mr. PODESTA. No. Senator BOXER. Mr. Stephanopoulos? Mr. STEPHANOPOULOS. No. Senator BOXER. Mr. Ickes? Mr. ICKES. No. Senator BOXER. Well, I don't have any further questions, Mr. Chairman. I just feel that the holy book of these hearings from some of my colleagues' point of view is this Josh Steiner diary, and I worry a lot about that.
August 4, 1994 - Part 8
(17:35:16) That young man was not at that meeting, and so if we are going to use hearsay for some people to make a case that this White House exerted terrible pressure on Mr. Altman, I think it's important that we continue to get to the bottom of it. And from what I know from you Mr. Ickes, from Maggie Williams today and I'm going to ask Mr. Nussbaum, I think there were questions raised about this recusal issue and I'm sure it might have been something that was uncomfortable, but I do not see intense pressure being exerted. And I want to ask you this last time, would you say that intense pressure was in fact applied to Mr. Altman on the recusal issue by anyone in the White House? 388 Mr. ICKES. In -my view, no pressure was applied and Mr. Altman is a very sophisticated person who has served in Washington before. He, in my view, is not a person you push around. Senator BOXER. Thank you. The CHAIRMAN. Thank you, Senator Boxer. We are now coming down the home stretch on a vote on the Senate Floor. I'm going to, in a moment, put the Committee into recess and give the witnesses a chance to refresh themselves. I've said to Senator Kerry, who left early to vote, that when he comes back that he will start and resume the hearing and that we'll rotate at that point to the next Republican. Senator SARBANES. Could we just clarify one thing? The CHAIRMAN. Of course. Senator SARBANES. When Mr. Bennett was questioning Mr. Ickes about Nussbaum's excitable disposition, and Mr. Ickes said well his disposition is generally excitable, and therefore I think was making the point that he was not excited beyond that and then Mr. Stephanopoulos nodded and Mr. Bennett said well, I take that to mean a yes. The question is whether the nod was a yes to the question as to whether Nussbaum was excited or the nod was a yes to the Ickes observation that Nussbaum's general disposition is an excitable one. Mr. STEPHANOPOULOS. I think it was a nod to the Ickes observation, sir. Senator SARBANES. It was a nod to the Ickes observation. Mr. STEPHANOPOULOS. Yes, sir. Senator SARBANES. So you were in effect Mr. STEPHANOPOULOS. I was not at the meeting, I couldn't respond to that. Mr. ICKES. But Senator Sarbanes, I wanted to go back in a clarify Senator Bennett's-when he said he took that as a ye was a little disconcerted by that and what Id said before and what I say now is that Mr. Nussbaum's demeanor was his regular run of the mill, everyday demeanor. It was not anything in excess of what one who has worked with Mr. Nussbaum knows him to be. He's a very Senator SARBANES. That's how I understood your answer. And you were making the point that his usual demeanor is what other people would regard as excitable. Mr. ICKES. I think compared to myself or Mr. Stephanopoulos, he works at a higher level. Senator SARBANES. We're certainly guaranteeing that when he appears before us, he'll be quite excitable. The CHAIRMAN. He'll have to be now. When he comes in this afternoon, if he's not excitable, then he's got a problem. Senator SARBANES. I was concerned because Mr. Bennett took a nodding by Mr. Stephanopoulos and he says well, I take that to be a yes and the question was what was Mr. Stephanopoulos nodding yes to. Your observation that Nussbaum's usual demeanor is an ex- citable one or Mr. Bennett's question that Nussbaum was excited in the sense beyond the ordinary I take it. Mr. STEPHANOPOULOS. I was nodding to Mr. Ickes. Mr. ICKES. He was not beyond the ordinary, Senator. 389 The CHAIRMAN. But if he's perpetually excited how would we know when he was beyond the norm? What would he do then? Does he break furniture, or what happens? Anyway you can answer that later. The Committee stands in recess for the duration of the vote. (17:39:22) [Recess.] (17:39:30) Commentary of hearing hosts DON BODE and NINA TOTENBERG from tv studio, they also talk to J. WILLIAM CADINHA Majority Counsel
Sports: This Will Bowl You Over
Sports: This Will Bowl You Over A trickster who never fails to draw a crowd is Andy Varipapa, an artist on the alleys who has enough tricks to pin other bowlers to duck pins. Dallas kids eat it up. Older man bowling, perfect strike. Variety of bowling ball tricks, stunts. Trick shot artist. CU Andy Varipapa smiling.
Leaping Pole Contest
Leaping Pole Contest Necessity is the mother of sport --- in The Netherlands, that is. They hold an annual leaping-pole contest over a ditch, a sport that was once a necessity in getting from field to field on the farm. Various attempts, funny. Boy runs and jumps on pole, makes it half way across water, and pole turns making him fall sideways into the water. Another attempt when a man, loses his grip and slides down the pole into the water. Crowd shots, laughing, also people pop up out of seats to get a better look.
WAA March
WAA March The depression was still with us. Thousands of jobless marched on Washington to demand sufficient government-made jobs. People gathered on cots in park. Women sew WAA banners (Workers Alliance of America). Black (African American) marchers carry sign : "Put the Schwellenbach - Allen Bill into Effect". Marchers protest cutbacks by the WPA.
De Gaulle's Historic Visit
De Gaulle's Historic Visit President Charles De Gaulle arrives in Bonn to begin the first State visit to Germany by a French Chief of State in modern times. His main discussion with Chancellor Adenauer will pivot around political union with other European countries. Cameraman with telephoto lens. CU German Flag. De Gaulle shaking hands with Chancellor Adenauer.
The House Of Dior Presents....
The House Of Dior Presents.... The Fall flowers that will brighten Autumn will not outshine the new Paris fashions, a typical cross-section of which is displayed. It's the lean, narrow look that's in the stars. Women models wearing coats, wool and fur trimmed. Most of the models wear gloves and hats. Side view of model smoking, backs out of frame to see three models wearing coats. Basic white and black dresses, with velvet trim. Women model elegant evening gowns, jewelry.
British Air Show Thriller
British Air Show Thriller The Farnborough Air Show --- Britain's showcase for new aircraft --- displays the latest from the drawing boards: some radical planes that may reshape aviation transport. Men seated in crowd, looking up at sky. Aircraft with long nose, P-1127 in flight, and makes a vertical landing. Helicopter type invention. Transport plane, troop carrier. INT view aboard aircraft with paratroopers ready to jump. Side view of plane, as paratroopers, freefall with flares attached to their ankles. Another great interior shot as the skydivers jump from the plane. CU boy looking up to the sky. Parachute opens. Flares on ground. Parachutes float to the ground. Fighter planes in formation. Precision flying. CU fighter pilot in cockpit, maple leaf on helmet ? CU older woman, wearing sunglasses looking up to the sky. Fighter pilots, vapor trails. Acrobatic flying.
She's De-Lovely!
She's De-Lovely!: Ohio Lass Crowned New "Miss America" There's a parade of 54 pulchritudinous peaches in the finals for the title of "Miss America" at Atlantic City. 54 good reasons to see America first! The winner is Jacquelyn Jeanne Mayer, 20, a Northwestern University co-ed who makes good. WS stage with contestants parading the catwalk. Pan judges watching contestants. Contestants seated with floral bouquets, gentlemen escorts stand behind them wearing tuxedos. Judges marking sheets. Miss Ohio is selected and covers her face. Photographers. Winner is crowned and kissed on cheek. Miss America 1963 walks along stage wearing crown, cape and carrying rose bouquet. Next day, Ms. Mayer meets press photographers on a city rooftop. Miss America wearing crown, smiling, blows kiss to the camera wearing white gloves.
DeGaulle Ends German Visit
DeGaulle Ends German Visit The French leader and Chancellor Adenauer conclude a series of talks on Franco-German unity that will probably influence deeply the current talks of British Commonwealth partners on Britain's entry into the European Common Market. De Gaulle and Adenauer shake hands with guests at state dinner. Pan down Cathedral, men gathered outside. De Gaulle exits cathedral with religious clergy. CU sign : pedestrian crossing.
August 4, 1994 - Part 8
(17:51:24) Hearings coverage resumes: Senator ROTH. I would just point out that the Nussbaum memorandum does go on to state, and I quote, "there is generally no justification for any White House involvement in particular adjudicative or rulemaking proceedings," and investigative proceedings are 390 covered as well. Then it points out that, regarding pending criminal and civil matters, the memorandum states "it undermines the administration of justice if the White House even appears to be interfering in such cases." Do you agree with that statement? Mr. STEPHANOPOULOS. I certainly follow the memo and I agree with the memo, sir. I do believe, sir, and maybe I'm mistaken , but I do believe in the memo there are certain defined exceptions for getting information or especially for dealing with press matters, Still it is wise and it is-we are supposed to talk with the Counsel first, but I believe there is some exemption for information and press matters. If I'm mistaken, I stand to be corrected. Senator ROTH. Insofar as I am aware, there are no exceptions for press purposes. The memorandum, as a matter of fact, is quite sweeping in its language, and says specifically that in cases involving investigative, adjudicative or regulatory matters that the Office of White House Counsel should be or must be contacted. Mr. STEPHANOPOULOS. I agree with that, sir, and it certainly was an oversight on my part not to contact the Counsel's Office. Senator ROTH. Was any effort made with this memorandum, to make sure that all White House personnel were familiar with the memorandum and its requirements? Mr. STEPHANOPOULOS. It had been circulated. Senator ROTH. It had been circulated. Was any effort given to actually educate people as to what the memorandum required? Mr. STEPHANOPOULOS. I believe at the time it probably was, sir. As I said, this was a year later. There's no excuse, I grant you. It was an oversight on my part not to contact the Counsel and that was a mistake. Senator ROTH. Mr. Ickes, do you recall that you and Mr. Stephanopoulos had this phone conversation with Mr. Altman? Mr. ICKES. Yes. Senator ROTH. And are or were you familiar with Mr. Nussbaum's memorandum prohibiting such contact? Mr. ICKES. I'm generally familiar, yes. Senator ROTH. What do you mean by "generally"? Mr. ICKES. Well, I couldn't give you word by word, Senator, but I have read the memorandum, and I'm familiar with the thrust of the memorandum. Senator ROTH. Did you seek approval from the White House Counsel? Mr. ICKES. No, I did not. I associate myself with Mr. Stephanopoulos' remarks in that regard but I would also point out that the purpose of that, of the phone call that we made was to ver- ify whether or not Mr, Altman had in fact recused himself. We were taking press calls on that, and felt that we really needed to know so we could respond accurately and quickly to the press, but again I associate myself with Mr. Stephanopoulos' remarks. We should have contacted the Counsel's Office. Senator ROTH. One of the conversations at least, Mr. Stephanopoulos, was to determine how Mr. Stephens was hired and that was, I believe, not public information at that time. 391 Mr. STEPHANOPOULOS. I'm not certain that's true, sir. It certainly is information that would be provided to the public. I assume it was done by an open and independent board. Senator ROTH. Let me ask you, Mr. Ickes, do you agree that that telephone conversation was in conflict with the requirements of the ethics memorandum?
August 4, 1994 - Part 8
(18:05:22) The CHAIRMAN. Mr. Ickes, before you respond and again excuse me for interrupting and I say to my friend from North Carolina, that particular memo, which was the last document to come to us, really falls into two parts. There is a part that in effect is within the scope of our inquiry and then there is a part that is not. I think it's appropriate to ask questions about the part that's within the scope of the inquiry, but I think we run into an issue of getting beyond that and so I would just say to Mr. Ickes that you should restrict your response to the part of the memo that's within the scope of this charter that we have. Senator FAIRCLOTH. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. The CHAIRMAN. Thank you. Mr. ICKES. Mr. Chairman, I would-I'm somewhat at a disadvantage because I don't have the document in front of me. It's my understanding- The CHAIRMAN. We're going to send it out to you and mark it out so that we're true to our mission here. And let's suspend the clock for a minute so that your time is not running while we do this and we'll just hold things in place until such time as you have a chance to do this. You better take it down and explain it. I appreciate Senator FAIRCLOTH. I understand. The CHAIRMAN [continuing]. The forbearance here. [Pause.] And if there's any confusion, Mr. Ickes, if you're not exactly clear, ask for guidance and I'll see that you have the guidance, So, Senator Faircloth, we'll restore that time and do you want to pose the question again or leave it as it sits and let Mr. Ickes answer within the scope of what Senator FAIRCLOTH. I'll leave it as it sits if he remembers it and answer within the scope that's within the bounds of what we're doing. The CHAIRMAN. Fair enough. Senator FAIRCLOTH. If he doesn't remember it, I'll read it again. Mr. ICKES. Senator, just so the record is clear, I've been handed three pieces of paper. As I understand it there were many more pieces of paper involved in this document or set of documents. The first one is a memorandum to the First Lady from Harold Ickes, dated 1 March 1994. I've been informed by Counsel that the first paragraph of that two-paragraph memorandum or actually threeparagraph memorandum is redacted, that the only one that is within the scope of this hearing is the second one. And then there is I have two other pieces of paper in front of me which apparently are part of a memorandum that I gather was attached to the socalled transmittal memorandum of which only a limited amount of those two pages are within the scope. 395 So based on that, could I trouble you to ask your question again? I'm sorry. Senator FAIRCLOTH. Well, my question is why would the White House staff send Hillary Clinton a memo about something that happened before she was First Lady and about which the White House and she as an individual says nothing is wrong, why would you be sending her such a memo? Mr. ICKES. Primarily informative, Senator. This was a matter that was being discussed, if not daily certainly very frequently, in the press. Her relationship with Rose Law Firm, as you've pointed out, was well known and it was my understanding that two of the memorandum included in this discussed the relationship of the FDIC as well as the RTC to the Rose Law Firm. It was merely being sent to her as a matter of information and interest. Senator FAIRCLOTH. But she had a pretty intense interest in what was going on here, isn't that correct? Mr. ICKES. Certainly-she certainly in my view had an interest because it involved her name and it involved her prior law firm. I would like to say for the record however, Senator, that it is not at all clear to me that this memorandum, that is the transmittal memorandum which I described earlier was in fact sent.
Mrs. Cotner
Preview Cassette 220566 Mrs. Cotner - running against Mayor Ralph Perk. She is shopping & shakes hands with people.
Mrs. Perk
Preview Cassette 220566 Mrs. Perk - wife of Mayor Ralph Perk. She is grocery shopping. She tells reporters she doesn't think a woman can be mayor. It is too big of a job.
Horse Goldstein
Preview Cassette 220566 Horse Goldstein
August 4, 1994 - Part 8
(17:55:53) Mr. ICKES. I think in hindsight, Senator, there is no question that we should have, Mr. Stephanopoulos and I should have contacted Counsel's Office, but again I want to be within the, I think, both the letter and the spirit of the memorandum. But again I want to emphasize that the purpose of the phone call was to verify whether or not he'd recused himself so that we could respond accurately and quickly to the press in that regard. Senator ROTH. Again, let me ask you, was there any effort made to educate White House staff members about the requirements of this memorandum? Mr. ICKES. I didn't join the White House staff Senator until January. I don't know when that memorandum was circulated. I know that when I came to the White House staff, a copy of it was given to me. I don't know what steps in general were taken. Senator ROTH. A copy was given you when you were first employed? Mr. ICKES. Yes. Mr. STEPHANOPOULOS. Sir, if I may. I don't have the Nussbaum memorandum in front of me, but I would just like to clarify. I'm not certain that this was an investigative or an adjudicative matter that required the clearance. I would say in the future it would also always be prudent to get that clearance and clearly in hindsight, it would have helped to have talked to the Counsel first. But I do believe seeking this information was entirely proper. Remember, this was a discussion that began with discussing what Mr. Altman was saying to the press about the recusal. It was not dealing specifically with the investigative or the adjudicative system. And second, it was a question about how Jay Stephens came to be hired. Again I'm not certain, I do not have the memorandum in front of me. I can say, as I said to you earlier, that clearly talking to the Counsel first would be prudent and would be smart. And it would probably have been better had we done it, but I'm not certain, if you are talking about the letter of the guidelines, how that falls. But that's simply a point that can be clarified by looking at them. Senator KERRY. Senator Roth, let me say that we're already over by a minute or so. I don't want to cut you off, like the Chairman did, but I just want Senator ROTH. I want to point out that I think the memorandum is very clear and there are no exceptions to its requirements and of course it was written for non-lawyers, so I do not think it is particularly technical. So I agree with you that this is in conflict with the requirements of the Nussbaum memorandum. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Senator KERRY. Senator Campbell. Senator CAMPBELL. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 392 Mr. Lindsey, it's my understanding you said you told President Clinton about the press inquiries on the Madison referrals; is that correct? Mr. LINDSEY. Yes, sir. Senator CAMPBELL. That was after the call on October 4th from Jim Lyons in Denver. Mr. LINDSEY. That's correct. Senator CAMPBELL. Did the President have any reaction, or did he instruct you to take any action or not to take any action or to do anything? Mr. LINDSEY. No, he did not instruct me to do anything, didn't ask me to do anything, didn't suggest I do anything. And I didn't do anything. Senator CAMPBELL. Also, you testified at one point that when Roger Altman came to the White House to say that he had decided not to recuse himself, some people congratul ated him. We've had different, conflicting testimony about the reaction to his decision to recuse himself As a Senior Adviser to the President, did you feel any responsibility to encourage him to do so or to not do so? Mr. LINDSEY. Well, first of all, I don't think that's my testimony. I was not in the meeting when Roger came to the White House, so I have no idea what happened. Senator CAMPBELL. My notes may be in error, thanks, I appreciate that. Mr. Stephanopoulos, Mr. Steiner describes in his diary rather descriptively and vividly your phone call with him. You don't remember it that way and didn't recollect saying anything like we should get rid of him, talking about Mr. Stephens. But you have said that you were blowing off steam. Do you remember any specific things you did say in that conversation dealing with Mr. Stephens?
August 4, 1994 - Part 8
(18:00:15) Mr. STEPHANOPOULOS. It was a very brief conversation, sir, but what I do remember as, I said earlier, was I know that I asked how Jay Stephens came to be hired and I was very angry about it. And I mean, since I'm under oath I can admit I'm still angry about it. I'm mystified at how Jay Stephens, who is such a public opponent of the President, a man who had accused the President of obstruction of Justice, a man who along with 93 other U.S. Attorneys had his resignation asked for and instead of accepting it like all the other 93 U.S, Attorneys, went on a public attack against the President. A man who is using fundraising letters, the lure of disclosing Grand Jury testimony in fundraising letters. A man who had been accused of disclosing Grand Jury testimony in public. I thought that that was just unfair to the President. I couldn't understand how he could have been hired by an impartial board to prosecute this case. And I was very angry about it, I'm still angry about it. Senator CAMPBELL. Well, I believe as Senator Bryan does, that's certainly understandable. Did the President and the First Lady have any concerns Mr. STEPHANOPOULOS. I didn't discuss this with them. Senator CAMPBELL. They never asked you to call the Treasury Department about him or asked you to put any pressure on anyone Mr. STEPHANOPOULOS. No, sir, they did not. 393 Senator CAMPBELL [continuing], To remove him from the Madison investigation; correct? Mr. STEPHANOPOULOS. No, sir, Senator CAMPBELL. Mr. Podesta, I know what a Secretary does. I know what an Assistant Secretary does. And I know what an Under Secretary does. But I'm not quite sure what a Staff Secretary does. Would you tell me what is your role at the White House, please? I mean, I read part of your job description, it says something about controlling the paper flow to the President. Mr. PODESTA. That's pretty accurate, Senator. I think that in many agencies, the role is described as the Executive Secretary. Any paper, memoranda, et cetera, that are coming into the President are forwarded through my office. I coordinate senior staff response to that and forward it to the President and take care of it when it comes back out from him. Senator CAMPBELL. Well, how did you get stuck with making a call to Mr. Altman? Is that also part of the job description, the mail and the calls, too? Mr. PODESTA. I ask myself that question quite often, Senator. I think that in the context of the-my assignment from Mr, McLarty, as I said which was limited, but I had the assignment of watching this hearing and then in the wake of the meeting we held in my office and perhaps in- particularly, I'm having a little trouble with the mike and seeing you also. Perhaps particularly because one of the issues was of such personal concern to Mr. Nussbaum which is how the meeting was set up, I think it just-I drew the straw and as I said, I was there not only with Mr. Lindsey but with four members of the White House Counsel staff, but we agreed that I would be tasked to do it and I did it. Senator CAMPBELL. "We agreed," meaning who? Mr. PODESTA. Mr. Nussbaum, Mr. Mein, Mr. Eggleston, Mr. Sloan, Mr. Lindsey and myself Senator CAMPBELL. We also heard a lot about the discussions among the White House staff about correcting Mr. Altman's February 2nd testimony. Did anyone argue for not correcting them or postponing correcting them or anything of that nature? Mr. PODESTA. The February 24th testimony? Senator CAMPBELL. Yes. Mr. PODESTA. Quite the contrary. I think it was a strong concern that the testimony be corrected and be corrected promptly. Senator CAMPBELL. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I will yield the rest of my time. The CHAIRMAN. Thank you, Senator Campbell. Senator Faircloth, Senator FAIRCLOTH. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Ickes, on March Ist, you forwarded a memo to Hillary Clinton regarding the Resolution Trust Corporation. You attached a copy of a February 17th FDIC report about possible conflicts of interest regarding the Rose Law Firm, Hillary Clinton's old law firm, representing the FDIC against Madison Guaranty Savings & Loan. We were given that confidential document to prepare for this hearing. I was interested in it for several reasons, well, one was I was mentioned in it. But Mrs. Clinton worked for the Rose Law Firm before her husband was elected 394 President. She says there was no conflict of interest even though she represented Madison Guaranty before it was closed, then her law firm represented the FDIC against Madison Guaranty_ against Madison Guaranty after it was closed. So my question is this, why would White House staff send Hillary Clinton a memo about something that happened before she was the First Lady and about something in which they say and she says nothing is wrong? Mr. ICKES. It's not clear, Senator, that that memorandum
August 4, 1994 - Part 8
(18:10:26) Senator FAIRCLOTH. Mr. Lindsey. Mr. LINDSEY. Yes, sir. Senator FAIRCLOTH. 1 believe you said earlier that you are originally from Arkansas; is that right? Mr. LINDSEY. Yes, sir, I am. Senator FAIRCLOTH. Before coming to Arkansas, how long had you lived there? I mean, before coming to Washington, excuse me, how long had you lived in Arkansas? Mr, LINDSEY. I was born and raised in Arkansas. I went to undergraduate school in Memphis. I then came to Washington as a Legislative Assistant to Senator Fulbright and to attend law school. I went back to Arkansas in 1975. Senator FAIRCLOTH. How many years were you in Arkansas? Mr. LINDSEY. Well, I mean, I've lived in Washington and Arkansas. I lived in Arkansas from 1975 until 1979 when I moved back to Washing-ton. I moved back to Arkansas in 1981 and lived there until 1993 when I joined the Clinton Administration. Senator FAIRCLOTH, How long have you known Bill Clinton? Mr. LINDSEY. I met him in 1968. Senator FAIRCLOTH. Mr. Lindsey, The Washington Post describes your role in the Clinton Administration in the following terms, and I quote, "Lindsey is like the plumber who fixes the faucet when the family is at work and slips the key back through the mail slot. No one saw him, but the problem is gone." Now, I certainly believe Senator KERRY. Where can I find that kind of plumber? Senator FAIRCLOTH. I believe that was intended and certainly is a favorable description of your effectiveness in the Administration. You would agree with that I hope? Mr. LINDSEY. I'm not sure I understood what it meant when I read it. 396 Senator FAIRCLOTH. Do you at times handle press inquiries relat-ing to matters in Arkansas involving President Clinton? Mr. LINDSEY. Yes, sir. Senator FAIRCLOTH. When was the first time you heard of the RTC investigation into Madison Guaranty? Mr. LINDSEY. Well, I guess the first time was in 1979 [19891 when they brought lawsuit against Jim McDougal. Senator FAIRCLOTH. Who brought the lawsuit against Mr. McDougal? Mr. LINDSEY. The Justice Department did. Senator FAIRCLOTH. You've been familiar with it from day 1 pretty much? Mr. LINDSEY, Again, being from Arkansas, I was aware that Jim McDougal was tried and acquitted. Senator FAIRCLOTH. Mr. Lindsey, are you aware of any communication between anyone at the White House and anyone at the Justice Department regarding press inquiries relating to the Resolution Trust Corporation criminal referral? Senator DODD. Mr. Chairman, I just-on a scope, is this The CHAIRMAN. I'm waiting for Senator FAIRCLOTH. This is before the September 29th "headsup" meeting. The CHAIRMAN. I was waiting for Senator Faircloth to finish his question here. Senator FAIRCLOTH. That would be The CHAIRMAN. I think the problem we have with that as well is when we get into the issue of Justice Department activity that's still under inquiry by Mr. Fiske, that is sort of screened off from us at this point, that that would fall into that prohibited area. Senator FAIRCLOTH. Mr. Chairman, this was a press inquiry. I didn't ask about-regarding press inquiries relating to the RTC criminal referral before September 29th. This is not White House. This is press. The CHAIRMAN. But did I understand you to say it was a contact of the Justice Department? Senator FAIRCLOTH. I'll read it again. The CHAIRMAN. Excuse me, I'm not trying to be argumentative, I'm just trying to understand. Senator FAIRCLOTH. That's right. Are you aware of any communication between anyone at the White House and anyone at the Justice Department regarding press inquiries relating to the RTC criminal referral before the September 29th "heads- up" meeting? The CHAIRMAN. Here, if I may say, the problem is not the subject of a press inquiry which would appear to be innocuous. It's the issue of a contact to the Justice Department and that area is still under active review by the Special Prosecutor and that's why question in that area Senator DODD. Independent Counsel. The CHAIRMAN. I meant to say Independent Counsel. That's why that area for the time being is fenced off. We'll get into that at a later time, but we can't at this time. Senator FAIRCLOTH. Mr. Chairman, I'll make a trade with you, I'll withdraw the question if you'll give me my time back. 397 The CHAIRMAN. Yes, I will. Senator DODD. Don't use that as a tactic all the time. [Laughter.] Senator FAIRCLOTH. Mr. Lindsey, I believe up until January or so you headed the White House Office of Personnel; is that correct? Mr, LINDSEY. Until November 1993, 1 was Director of the Office of Presidential Personnel. Senator FAIRCLOTH. The Washington Post reported that you helped the President pick, and I quote, "legal talent," Mr. LINDSEY. I still deal with judges, U.S. Attorneys, and Marshals.
Sports: Run For The Roses
Sports: Run For The Roses An eight-to-one shot, coming from nowhere in the stretch, outruns four other horses to take the (88th running) Kentucky Derby in record time. "Decidedly" clips a full second from "Whirlaway's" 1941 record. Crowds milling around. CU sign with horse shoe reads DERBY 1962. Three women seated in lawn chairs, wear hats. Woman speaking - no sound - with drink in hand. Willie Hardtack, number 5 on sleeve. Eddie R. Carole ? signing autographs. View from upper deck of starting gate. CU hand on lever, thumb pushes down, bell sound (audio). Horses run out of gate. Man looking through binoculars. Two older men in crowd wear hats and sunglasses, waving on horses behind fence. Man slaps paper in hand, after losing race, (disappointment) woman standing next to him with turban hat and glasses seems to laugh at outcome. Horse and jockey (wearing number 3) in winners circle.
August 4, 1994 - Part 8
(18:15:04) Senator FAIRCLOTH. As you may be aware, Roger Altman testified before us Tuesday and one of the items discussed was his diary, as he has called it, or a scrapbook of historical significance. After a meeting with Maggie Williams, Hillary Clinton's Chief of Staff, on January 11th, Mr. Altman wrote that he had gotten the impression the White House was actively trying to negotiate officials at the Justice Department the scope and jurisdiction of what a Special Counsel could look into. This, of course, was prior to the appointment of the Special Counsel. The point being that after months of opposing the appointment of a Special Counsel, the Clintons were finally about to succumb to the growing political pressure and to ask the Attorney General to appoint a Special Counsel, but not until they first tried to limit what he could look into. Mr. Fiske, did you-Mr. Lindsey rather., did you talk with Robert Fiske prior to his appointment as Special Counsel? Mr. LINDSEY. No, sir. Senator FAIRCLOTH, Did you talk with Bernard Nussbaum about Mr. Fiske before his appointment as Special Counsel? Mr. LINDSEY. I don't believe so. I think I had heard that Mr. Fiske's name had been mentioned as a possible candidate, but I don't believe Senator FAIRCLOTH. This is an important question: Did you talk with Bernard Nussbaum about Robert Fiske prior to his appointment as Special Counsel? Mr. LINDSEY. Again, I think I had heard that Mr. Fiske's name was one of the names being mentioned, Bernie and I may have talked about that, but we didn't talk in any detail about it, it was simply a discussion about the newspaper accounts. Senator FAIRCLOTH. Did you talk with anyone at the Justice Department concerning jurisdiction or scope of the Special Counsel? Mr. LINDSEY. No, sir, I did not and I do not know of anyone in the White House who did. Senator FAIRCLOTH. Thank you. And thank you, Mr. Chairman. The CHAIRMAN. Senator Sarbanes, do I understand (18:17:02)(tape #10093 ends)
August 4, 1994 - Part 9
(18:13:13)(tape #10094 begins) that is sort of screened off from us at this point, that that would fall into that prohibited area. Senator FAIRCLOTH. Mr. Chairman, this was a press inquiry. I didn't ask about-regarding press inquiries relating to the RTC criminal referral before September 29th. This is not White House. This is press. The CHAIRMAN. But did I understand you to say it was a contact of the Justice Department? Senator FAIRCLOTH. I'll read it again. The CHAIRMAN. Excuse me, I'm not trying to be argumentative, I'm just trying to understand. Senator FAIRCLOTH. That's right. Are you aware of any communication between anyone at the White House and anyone at the Justice Department regarding press inquiries relating to the RTC criminal referral before the September 29th "heads- up" meeting? The CHAIRMAN. Here, if I may say, the problem is not the subject of a press inquiry which would appear to be innocuous. It's the issue of a contact to the Justice Department and that area is still under active review by the Special Prosecutor and that's why question in that area Senator DODD. Independent Counsel. The CHAIRMAN. I meant to say Independent Counsel. That's why that area for the time being is fenced off. We'll get into that at a later time, but we can't at this time. Senator FAIRCLOTH. Mr. Chairman, I'll make a trade with you, I'll withdraw the question if you'll give me my time back. 397 The CHAIRMAN. Yes, I will. Senator DODD. Don't use that as a tactic all the time. [Laughter.] Senator FAIRCLOTH. Mr. Lindsey, I believe up until January or so you headed the White House Office of Personnel; is that correct? Mr, LINDSEY. Until November 1993, 1 was Director of the Office of Presidential Personnel. Senator FAIRCLOTH. The Washington Post reported that you helped the President pick, and I quote, "legal talent," Mr. LINDSEY. I still deal with judges, U.S. Attorneys, and Marshals.
Cheering crowd
crowd cheering at night
Golden ground squirrel
Golden ground squirrel