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August 1, 1994 - Part 5
(17:05:07) At the outset, I indicated that I only know one way to do things: With honesty, and consistent with, legal and ethical requirements. I testified extensively before the staff of this Committee, and this is the seventh day that I have given sworn testimony before a governmental investigative body. I have tried to give this Committee, albeit in abbreviated form today, my best recollection of what occurred and why. I am satisfied that I have given you my best recollection, as I have done on each prior occasion that I have testified and the numerous additional times that I have been interviewed. I have no doubt about the propriety of my actions, and I have no reason to doubt the propriety of anyone else's. I thank the Committee for the opportunity to make this statement and I welcome any questions that the Committee may have. The CHAIRMAN. Lees start if we may Senator SARBANES. Mr. Chairman, can I ask-are there copies available of Ms. Hanson's opening statement? The CHAIRMAN. Thank you, Senator Sarbanes. No, we were not given copies. If I may--do you have copies or could we-if you'll let us have what you just read, we'll Xerox it, so we can circulate it to Members of the Committee. Ms. HANSON. We sent 120 copies at 9 a.m. The CHAIRMAN. Apparently, they haven't arrived. Until they're located, it would be helpful if we could just take your statement and make some copies. They're probably somewhere making their way here. In any event, we do want to have copies in front of us. I want to go to the testimony before this Committee on February 24, 1994, that you've made some reference to and which other witnesses today have talked about. As I understand it, there was very careful preparation done ahead of time for that meeting. Several hours were devoted on at least 3 or 4 different days leading up to that hearing. Material was put together, a group met, you were part of the group, Mr. Altman was part of the group, the questions were discussed, and all of this was gone through in some detail. Is that correct? Ms. HANsoN. That's correct. It was a massive amount of material. The CHAIRMAN. In any event, is it fair to say that Mr. Altman was well-briefed by the time that hearing started? It sounds to me as if everybody really focused on getting ready for that bearing. Is that a fair conclusion? Ms. HANsON. There was a focus on----clearly, there was a focus 01, preparing for the hearing. As I said, there was a massive 'mount of work to do, a tremendous scope of issues to be covered. Although we did our best, on many, many issues there was not as in-depth a review as we would have liked. The CHAIRMAN. But you testified today, and also in your deposi- on that, as you were listening to Mr. Altman answer questions 104 that day, questions you yourself have cited from Senator Bond Senator Gramm, that-and ve been careful as to how you put it, but that you were -- the answers in and of themselves were not complete, and in your mind, in effect, you thought, well, those can be amplified later. Is that a fair conclusion for me to draw from what you've just said? Ms. HANSON. Yes, I thought the entire testimony needed to be re- . viewed. The CHAIRMAN. On the recusal issue, it seemed to me, you also seemed to be saying you were somewhat surprised that, when Mr. Altman was asked to summarize anything that was of an consequence, he omitted any discussion of the recusal even though that was in the preparation document that you'd helped put together Were you surprised that he left that out? Ms. HANSON, Yes. The CHAIRMAN. Did you say something to him about it after you left the Committee room? Ms. HANSON. No. I didn't The CHAIRMAN. Why? Ms. HANSON. He left before I did and I didn't go back with him. The CHAIRMAN. How about in the days that followed, did you have any occasion to mention that to him. MS. HANSON. Not that specific issue. As I stated, I knew during the course of the testimony-the course of the hearing that there were a number of issues that needed to be followed up. I did not have a copy of the transcript until substantially later, and it was my intention to go through the transcript carefully and raise all of the issues with Mr. Altman at once. The CHAIRMAN. Didn't I hear you say in your prepared statement, though, that when you went over to the meeting at the White House, Mr. Altman went over with the idea in mind of saying be was going to recuse himself and then encountered some pressure, some resistance to that, and decided not to recuse himself? Didn't I hear you say this a minute ago? Ms. HANSON. I wouldn't characterize it as pressure. There was a discussion of the issue, and I understood Mr. Altman to have listened to the discussion and considered it, but I wouldn't have
August 1, 1994 - Part 5
(17:10:07) The CHAIRMAN. Let's leave the pressure part out. The point is, he heard a contrary point of view and it caused him, in a sense, to revisit his decision. Is that a fair summary? Ms. HANSON. Yes. The CHAIRMAN. The fact that occurred, and it was significant enough that you just described it here to us in your prepared statement, it seems to me, when that was omitted when he was asked a question that clearly was designed to encompass such things as that, at some point, either right then or shortly thereafter, you know you had some obligation to remind him of the fact that, for whatever reason, that had been left out. You say you didn't do that. Ms. HANsON. Sir, as I stated, this issue, the recusal issue has assumed a tremendous-much more importance than it had at that particular time. At that particular time, there were a lot--tbere were a number of issues that I knew needed to be followed up. I fully expected that this would all be handled in the ordinary course. What happened was that, with the appearance of The 105 Washington Post article and the service of the Grand Jury subpoenas, the orderly process of responding to questions and supplementing and reviewing the transcript terminated, at least my participation in it terminated. The CHAIRMAN. But other things did happen, and you also made reference to this in your statement. We began to get clarifying letters from Mr. Altman, as you know, shortly after the hearing. We got a series of letters. The first one came on March 2, 1994. The next letter came on March 3, 1994. The next letter came on March 11, 1994 and the next on March 21, 1994. What I'm struck by, among other things, is that, for example, in the first letter that came, you might have thought, if the recusal issue had been forgotten or overlooked even though it was in the briefing, it's in your briefing sheet, and was discussed, that in the case of his reflecting after the Committee hearing to the point he was going to prepare a memo and send it to us, which he did, that the recusal issue would occur to him and would go in that memo. But it didn't, did it? Ms. HANSON. If I might, sir. I was unaware of the last two of those letters until Grand Jury testimony. The letter of March until my 2, 1994, was prepared hastily for a specific purpose, which was to put you and the Committee on notice of the two fall meetings prior to learning about it in the press. The CHAIRMAN. Right. Ms. HANSON. It was not intended, by any stretch of the imagination, to completely supplement or correct the record. The CHAIRMAN. How about the second letter, then, on March 3, 1994? Ms. HANSON. The second letter on March 3, 19941 1 understood, was prepared by Mr. Altman, and I understood that he prepared it in response following a conversation that he had with you. I didn't know exactly what it was that Mr. Altman was intending to respond to at that time. and my-as I stated, I did not expect it, by any stretch of the imagination, to be a full correction and review of the transcript, which, to my recollection, I did not even have. I reviewed that letter solely to make sure that there was nothing in it that was affirmatively wrong. The CHAIRMAN. I think it's the issue of what's missing, as opposed to what's affirmatively wrong, that's the problem with the testimony before the Committee. My time is up, so I'll just make my point and then yield. My point is that, I think as a professional-and you clearly are that and I respect your professionalism and we've cited that here today-when the hearing was underway and pointed questions were being asked and were being followed up by follow-up questions, there was a requirement there on his part, and yours, to make sure that the answer was complete and responsive to what the question was. I think you, in effect, have said today that you had some concern about that-you phrased it carefully, but you said you were listening and you knew some things were not being said that, presumably, needed to be part of an answer. But then, you say he used words at the end that-what were the words that he used at the end of his statement Senator MACK. "That's the whole conversation." 106 The CHAMMAN. "That's the whole conversation," in other words,, I he used a very declarative summary comment. In your deposition, you say that, in your mind, when be said that was the whole con-' versation, in effect, he closed the door on you being able to lean forward to him and say, "By the way, you've left out recusal." Ms. HANSON. Sir, he bad an answer in front of him that had been gone over and he had reviewed that had the recusal issue ' in"' it. I did not know, as I sat there, why it was that he didn't include that in the discussion, but, as I sat there, I thought that I could give him a note and remind him about the recusal issue. I recall realizing that 1 had lost that opportunity
Royal Welcome: New Zealand Greets Queen
Royal Welcome: New Zealand Greets Queen. The Maoris who came from Polynesia 600 years ago welcome Queen Elizabeth and Prince Philip to New Zealand. Now loyal subjects, they perform their traditional war dances for the ruler before she goes to Auckland for the Royal Regatta. Off in the not too far distance sits the Queen's personal yacht, the Britannia. MCUS - A woman taking a picture of the Britannia. MS - Queen Elizabeth and Prince Philip being greeted by the Governor General of New Zealand. MCUS - Queen Elizabeth getting into a convertible. MS - Queen Elizabeth and Prince Philip standing up in the back of the convertible as they drive along in a motorcade,. MCUS - The tribal natives of perform their native war dance the 'haka'. MS - Queen Elizabeth and Prince Philip are at the beach looking at the boats that will be in a regatta. MS - A sail by of the mask boats salute Queen Elizabeth and Prince Philip. MS - The Queen and the Prince are off to Auckland as they return to the Britannia.
Easter Around The World
Easter Around The World. The most joyous day in Christendom sees churches from Maine to Hawaii thronged with the devout as they celebrate the Resurrection of Christ, each in his own way, each in his own faith. , The glory that is Easter is reflected in the facades of churches majestic and humble; it is found in the hearts that worship the miracle that was Christ's passion and the empty tomb on Easter Day. New Yorkers throng to parade along Fifth Avenue, services are held at Walter Reed Hospital in Washington and at the National Cathedral. As the nation rejoices they pause in sorrow - flags fly at half-mast in memory of those heroes who died aboard the submarine Thresher. In Vatican City Pope John gives his traditional blessing, "Urbi Et Orbi" -to Rome and the world. Christ is honored in every corner of the earth on this Easter Day of rejoicing. A sun rise over trees. MS - Outside shot of a lovely church where people are walking in to attend Easter Service. MS - another one of America's churches on Easter Sunday. More churches and more locations. Outside shot - People filing in to attend Easter Sunday Service. CUS - Stained glass window depicting the Birth of Christ. MS - Little Children holding song books queuing in to sing. OHS - People standing up in their church pews. First Baptist Church. MS - Pastor of the church shaking hands with the people coming out of church. OHS - People standing out side of New York's largest Cathedrals wearing their finest Easter wear. MS - The White House Walter Reed Army Medical Center. On the ground of the medical center a full dress army band marching through the throngs of people who have gathered here to celebrate Easter. MLS - Throngs of Christians attend for an out-door Easter Service. MS - The Vatican throngs of Christians standing wanting to be part of the religious experience. MLS - The pope blessing all the people. CUS - Some of the young Christians praying. CUS - Nuns. MLS - The Pope blessing the people
Kennedy In Crash: Senator Recovering from Plane Accident
"Misfortune strikes the Kennedy family once again. Senator Edward M. Kennedy is seriously injured when his private plane crashes in the woods near Southampton, Mass. Despite a broken back doctors expect his complete recovery within 8 to 10 months." MSs youthful Senator EDWARD KENNEDY (Ted Kennedy, D-MA) sitting at desk in office, reviewing paperwork, smiling into camera. TLS/MSs wreckage of downed single engine private prop plane in woods shrouded in fog (plane crash, accident scene). Rear view TLS/MSs police officers, detectives. MS sign "The Cooley Dickinson Hospital Entrance" pan left to hospital. TLS hospital building. MSs U.S. Attorney General ROBERT F. KENNEDY (RFK, Bobby Kennedy) talking with men outside hospital, then entering building. Rear view TLS press conference in hospital; MS doctors standing behind desk; MS Robert Kennedy speaking to reporters from podium.
August 1, 1994 - Part 5
(17:15:36) The CHAIRMAN. Because of that statement Ms. HANSON. Looking back at the transcript, I understand why I thought I had lost that opportunity, because he had stated that's all there was to the conversation. I believed, until I had the opportunity to sit down and talk with him in an orderly way, review the transcript with him, and answer not only that, but a number of other questions on the transcript, there was not a way to-certainly it was not appropriate to supplement the record in a piecemeal fashion. That was my view. The CHAIRMAN. We may come back to that. Ms. HANSON. No, on that day we were working on his actual recusal. If you recall. Senator D'AMATO. Wouldn't that be a time to say to him, by the way-- I mean, you work together, you're colleagues together? You did not mention the fact of this you, knew about it, and you said be was so declarative that you didn't want to get up and say, "By the way, you left out the recusal." Ms. HANSON. Let me state again, the responses in the testimony, there were a number of items in the testimony that I knew had to be reviewed and Senator D'AMATO. We'll come back to those. Let me yield to Senator Mack. Senator Mack. Senator D'Amato, my time is up. Senator D'AMATO. Mr. Chairman, I'm going to yield to Senator Mack, but I'd like to say that was February 24, 1994. Did you speak to him about the recusal issue, that he did not put it forth before this Committee the day after the testimony on February 25 1994? Senator MACK. Thank you, Senator D'Amato. Welcome, Ms. Hanson. We appreciate your testimony and the time that you've given to it. I'd like to review this with you chronologically, and touch on some of the things that you mentioned both in your statement today and also in the deposition earlier. Did you ever become aware that in the spring of 1993, Mr. Altman had faxed copies of press articles regarding Madison and Whitewater to Bernie Nussbaum that actually bad appeared 1 year earlier, in March 1992? Ms. HANSON, Is your question whether I knew it in the spring Of 1993? Senator MACK. Did you ever become aware that in the spring of 1993, Mr. Altman had faxed copies? 107 Ms. HANSON. I was recently shown a copy of a fax and I also heard from Mr. Nussbaum's testimony before the House last week that, in initial discussion with him on September 29, 1993, 1 mention= I understood Mr. Altman had given him some information on Madison. I had not independently recollected I had said that to him, but Mr. Altman did give me, at that same time in September, a copy of the same article that, it appears, he had faxed to Mr. Nussbaum in the spring don't I didn't know about it when it was done in the spring, and I recall the conversation with Mr. Nussbaum in the fall. Senator MACK. What you're testifying is that the first time you had knowledge of this was during your September 29, 1993, meeting with Mr. Nussbaum? Ms. HANSON. I'm saying I don't recall at that time-I don't recall, as I sit here now, that at that time I realized that it was the article, The New York Times article, that bad been faxed. I have been shown a faxed copy of that, along with a fax cover sheet recently. Senator MACK. You would have no knowledge that Mr. Altman has a file in which he had kept that? You didn see him take it out of that file? Ms. HANSON. He did take it out-when Mr. Altman gave me a copy of The New York Times article, it was taken out of a file that he ad. Senator MACK. How old an article was that? Ms. HANSON. It was an article that had appeared during the campaign. Senator MACK. Would that be in March 1992? Ms. HANSON. I believe so. Senator MACK. It sounds as if Mr. Altman had a file containing fairly extensive information relative to Madison. Ms. HANSON. I don't know what else was in the file, sir, he gave me a copy of the article. Senator MACK. Drawing your attention back to the fall of 1993. On September 27, 1993, did you have a discussion with Bill Roelle about nine new criminal referrals regarding Madison Guaranty? Ms. HANSON. Yes. Senator MACK. Please tell me about that discussion,
Candy Spots Takes Santa Anita
Two thrill-packed horse races are unveiled for racing fans. In the Santa Anita Derby four horses take a bad spill at the first turn as Candy Spots goes on to win handily. In the Flamingo at Hialeah, Never Bend hops into an early lead and is never headed. These are two horses to watch in this year's Kentucky Derby. California, Santa Anita track, throngs of fans. MS - Horses take off from the gate, thirteen three-year olds thunder by the stands. MS - Candy Spots breaks away ridden by Billy Shoemaker. MSOH - As the horses take the bend, Sky Jim runs out and four horses go down. Two jockeys stay down and one horse. All the jockeys are OK and one horse has to be destroyed. MSOH - Candy Spots and Sky Jim battle it out and the winner is Candy Spots #5. Florida's Hialeah race track, flamingos flying over head. MSOH - The horses break out of the gate for the 54th running of the Flamingo. MSOH - Down the stretch, Never Bend is running easily. MS - Never Bend is in the lead by a 8-length margin. MSOH - Never Bend and his jockey. Beautiful horse.
Record Floods: Thaw And Rains Hit 7 - State Area
Rampaging waters roar through the Ohio Valley as rain and melting snow trigger the worst flood conditions to hit many areas in 30 years. High drama at the height of the flood as two boys are rescued by helicopter after clinging to trees above a raging river for nine black hours. Eighteen deaths have been contributed to the rush of the flood waters. Raging and turbulent water rushing over some rocks in the Ohio Valley, houses in the Valley that are completely flooded up to their window sills. MS - The current of the water seems to be very strong as the water rushes through the valley. MS - Looks like white water as the melted snow combined with rain rush over farm land. MS - A 17-year old boy who climbed to the top of a tree is rescued by a helicopter, his boat overturned while he and his friend were searching for calves. MS - His friend being rescued by the helicopter, slowly the helicopter lifts the boy to safety. MCUS - Chopper has landed on the ground and two firemen rush up to help the boys, they carry one away from the chopper covered with a woolen blanket.
Defy DeGaulle: French Miners Continue Strike
The coal mines of France are idle as 200,000 workers defy orders from President Charles DeGaulle to return to their jobs. After a hard winter coal is in short supply and the strike is aggravating this. DeGaulle threatened the minors with server penalties - heavy fines and imprisonment and the strikers expressed outrage demanding a shorter workweek and a pay boost. Throngs gather and unite against the coal mines. The closed down coal mines, camera pans showing the result of the abandonment by the coal miners. MCUS - Strikers posting strike-signes. MSOH - Striking minors march united. MS - Street level, the striking minors walking in unity. CUS - Striking coal minor holding a sign; (De Galle - Des Sous!). Shot looking down from a balcony - A back of a head, throngs gathered in the towns square.
Skyline Giant: New Office Building Is World's Largest
A $100,000,000 beauty makes her debut on the New York scene as the Pan American Building is dedicated. It is the world's largest office building and it looks south to the Verrazano Bridge from the mainland to Staten Island where they have begun to spin the cables. Governor Rockefeller, Mayor Wagner, Mrs. Wilson, widow of builder are at dedication. Atop the 808 foot building is a helicopter landing deck. Looking up at the new giant building, MS - Outside of Pan American Airways Building and people going in through the revolving door. MCUS - Governor Rockefeller, Mayor Wagner and Mrs. Erwin Wilson dedicating the building and cutting a ribbon. MS - On top of the building two men walking about on the helicopter landing pad. MS - From atop of the roof you see the Empire State Building. MS - From the roof looking down at the United Nations Building and traffic on the street below. MS - The new Verrazano Bridge in the process of being built. MS - On top of the bridge looking straight ahead. MS - Looking up from the water at the unfinished bridge. CUS - Bridge cable that will support the roadway above the entrance to New York Harbor. CUS - Robert Moses, head of the Bridge Authority and President of New York's fourth coming World's Fair. MS - Crowd of people gathered at the bottom of the bridge to cheer on Robert Moses.
"Golden Globes" Top Acting Awards Go to Universal Stars
Golden Globes. The most coveted movie awards next to the Oscars are given by the Hollywood Foreign Press Association. Rock Hudson, Gregory Peck and Doris Day are among the top winners as they are honored with "Golden Globes." Also seen are Tony Randall, Edie Adams. Peck wins for "To Kill a Mockingbird", Hudson wins Male World Film Favorite, winning award 3x. Day gets award for Female World Film Favorite. Ambassador Cocoanut Grove and the marquee below in lights CUS - People queue up to see their favorite stars. CUS - Tony Randal. CUS - Gregory Peck. CUS - Doris Day. CUS - Doris Day and Rock Hudson in the back ground. MLS - Camera pans over the audience mostly made up of movie stars. CUS - Paparazzi taking pictures of Gregory Peck who just received his award. presented by Art Linkletter. MCUS - Jane Wyman presents Rock Hudson with his award. MS - Gregory Peck and his wife applauding for Rock Hudson. MCUS - Doris Day receives her award from Charlton Heston, Art Linkletter off to her right.
A Big Story: Baby Hippo Stages Own Water Show
Baby Hippo Stages Own Water Show. At California's Jungleland they've come up with a way to pool their resources - and have fun. Sam, a 9-month-old, 150 pound Hippo frolics in the old swimming hole with his instructor. When he grows up he'll be an actor - all two tons of him. Mila and baby hippo, Sam going into the poll with the assistance of zoo hippo keeper. MCUS - Zoo keeper rubbing Sam's nose the baby hippo is standing by the zoo keeper's other hand. MS - Zoo keeper chasing Sam around the pool, Sam jumps into the pool and the zoo keeper follows. CUS - Zoo keeper holding on to Sam as he swims and then he try s to hold him, no luck. MCUS - Baby Sam climbs out of the pool and the zoo keeper shares an apple with him. CUS - Looks like the baby hippopotamus is kissing the zoo keeper, very touching.
Flowery Forecast: Spring On Way - Here's Proof
It's time to start poking around in the tool shed when the flower show opens in New York. The Coliseum is a bower of beauteous blossoms as the 46th International Exhibit draws record crowds. The 5th International Flower Show and throngs are swarming around waiting to get in. MS - People queuing up to the displays. MLS - Four models standing in an inside man made garden, tree and all. MS - Queen of the Flower Show on one knee wearing a day dress and her crown, the girls in the back round are part of her court. CUS - Roses, maybe yellow or white. CUS - Tulips. MS - Judge with pen in hand taking notes, this will help him decide who wins. MS - Lots of people milling around and many flowers in the picture.
The USS Hope Returns In Triumph
The good ship Hope steams into New York after a 10-month visit to Peru. The fully-equipped floating hospital and school has treated 40,000 patients and benefited nearly 500,000 since 1960. USS Hope is welcomed in the New York Harbor by a tug boat spraying water. MS - An American Flag flying in the right corner of the frame, New York City skyline, port side (left) of the USS Hope as she is pulling into the New York Harbor, Hope is clearing seen on the port side of the ship. MS - The deck of the ship is crowded with people and staff. MS - Men, Women and a priest are on deck waving to the people waiting for them on the pier. MS - A group of boys along with adults on the deck of the ship. MS - Passengers and crew disembarking from the ship on to the gang plank, MCUS - Passengers, crew and people who are waiting for their loved one mix on the pier
Tibetan Kids Find Home In England
Twenty-two Tibetan children who were chosen by the Dalai Lama, Tibet's spiritual leader, are guests in England where they study as they would in their own country if the Chinese Reds hadn't driven them to exile. The children will be residents and attend school in 'The Pestalozzi Children s Village'. Two ladies and other adults are leading little Tibetan children up a path. CUS - Little Tibetan boys about 4 to 5 years old. CUS - The little boys have robes on - CUS - Their little faces. MS - The Dalai Lama (Bstan-'dzin-rgya-mtsho, 14th Dalai Lama, Tenzin Gyatso) sitting on a raised box looking down at the boy who are seated on the ground before him. CUS - Dalai Lama as he smiles and talks to the boys. MCUS - The boys are placing scarf s on the alter as a symbol. A plaque on a cement post "The Pestalozzi Children s Village". CUS - In the classroom there are Tibetan girls as well as boy receiving an education, being taught by a Buddhist Priest. CUS - Of the children eating English food and their enjoying it.
August 1, 1994 - Part 5
(17:20:22) Ms. HANSON. As I stated in my testimony, Mr. Roelle called me. I recall that he started out his conversation with a reference to Mr. Altman. He told me that nine criminal referrals relating to a company called Madison were on their way from the RTC in Kansas City to Washington, and from there they would go to the Justice Department. He summarized the referrals for me and told me the President and Mrs. Clinton were included in the referrals, solely, as. possible witnesses. He told me there bad been a referral the prior year in which the language relating to President and Mrs. Clinton could be read in such a way that it could be inferred, if additional investigatory work were done, they might be something more than potential witnesses, but that, in these referrals, these nine referrals, the President and First Lady 's names were included, solely, as possible witnesses. I understood from him, in that conversation that as soon as those referrals reached Washington, they ,Would be leaked, and the information in them would be leaked. 108 Senator MACK. Did you later relay the conversation about the referrals and the details of the referrals to Mr. Altman? MS. HANSON. I did, Senator MACK. When was that? Ms. HANSON. To my recollection, it was shortly after my conversation with Mr. Roelle. Senator MACK. By "shortly," are we talking about the same". Ms. HANSON. Yes. Senator MACK. Was it your testimony that Mr. Altman tasked with informing the White House about the referrals? you with Ms. HANSON. Yes. Senator MACK. Can you reconstruct that conversation for us?' Ms. HANsON. I recall that I spoke with Mr. Altman and to what I had learned from Mr. Roelle. I don't recall the specifies the conversation, but I recall being given the responsibility' ing Mr. Nussbaum that this information was going to leak press, because he was going to have to deal with it when the in inquiries began. Senator MACK. So, at this time, Mr. Roelle called you at the sug- gestion of Mr. Altman? Ms. HANsON. I-as I stated. I recall that Mr. Roelle started hi conversation with a reference to Mr. Altman, but I had no recollec- tion that he bad spoken with him before he spoke to me. Senator MACK. So, Mr. Roelle said that Mr. Altman had given instructions. Then, after your conversation with Mr. Roelle, you went to Mr. Altman and told him of this conversation. Ms. HANsON. That's correct. Senator MACK. During that conversation with Mr. Roelle, did he stress to you the importance of the confidentiality of this information? Ms. HANSON. I don't recall that, and I don't believe-I don't recall that at all, sir. Senator MACK. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. The CHAiRmAN. Thank you. Senator Dodd. Senator DODD. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you, Ms. Hanson, for being with us today. Let me start out with one question, if I may. You were hired as the Counsel to the Treasury. Is that correct? Ms. HANSON. That's correct. Senator DODD. Did anyone raise the question with you whether regarding--September 29, 1993, the time of the conversation with Mr. Roelle, whether or not you were the proper person to be talking to anyone at the RTC? We understand how Mr. Altman was wearing two hats at this point, but you were not working for the RTC. We discussed that, and the kind of problems it generates, this morning. Did you raise the question, or did anyone raise the question, that maybe you shouldn't be the person involved in this at all? Ms. HANSON. First, Mr. Altman had statutory authority to- Senator DODD. I understand that. Ms. HANSON. -for me to be involved in these matters, and Ithis call was unsolicited. This call came to me. I took the information and I provided it to Mr. Altman. 109 Senator DODD. Mr. Altman had statutory authority to be in his position. I was unclear bow you acquired that statutory authority. Ms. HANSON. The RTC CEO has the statutory authority to utilize employees, FDIC and other Executive Branch personnel, for RTC functions. As Deputy Secretary of the Treasury, be had the authority to grant that assistance, so, effectively, when he asked me to do something that was RTC-related, be had the statutory authority to make the request and to grant it.
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