July 20, 1995 - Part 3
July 20, 1995 - Part 3
(11:35:20) Mr. HINES. I would characterize it as unusual in our normal experiences, but, again, it's unusual for us to go to the White House and make that type of investigation. Senator SHELBY, Did you wonder if they had something to hide in those papers there? Mr. HINES. I just wondered why we didn't have any cooperation because we were only looking for limited information about why Mr. Foster would commit suicide, was there anything on his mind that might tend to have him take his own life. Senator SHELBY. But it was unusual procedure that was going on and it gave you reason to question what was going on, really? Mr. HINES. That was our perception. Senator SHELBY. OK. Thank you. The CHAIRMAN. Senator Sarbanes. Senator SARBANES. Senator Dodd. Senator DODD. Thank you, Senator. I'll take a few minutes then turn to counsel. First, let me thank all three of you. You've been before us before. You begin to wonder, I suppose, what your careers are. I suppose you spend a great deal of time just on this and there's a great deal of respect that all of us have for the jobs you have to do. Certainly, you probably didn't anticipate on that day in July two years ago that you'd be spending this much time going back and recounting events and details of those several days. So I thank you immensely for the time you dedicated to this and the effort that you've made to share with this Committee and others your recollections. I understand, and I appreciate immensely your jobs and your training and what you've got to do. Obviously, none of you knew Mr. Foster, I presume, before, you didn't know the family. You get a report the afternoon of July 20, 1993, late afternoon, and you respond to it, Sergeant Braun and Investigator Rolla, and you are doing your job, in effect. I wonder if you might, because I think it gets to the heart of what we're talking about here-you've got your job to do as investigators and we're trying to determine motivations and so forth, intents of people. The accusation is, in effect, by some that there was a corrupt intent here to somehow deprive investigators, you and others, of doing your job. That's the assumption some people have drawn. Others are saying they're not sure about that, it doesn't look that way necessarily. You are dealing with a traumatic event, here and the people were acting in a rather human way given the circumstances. We're asking you, in a sense, to try to shed some light on this, and there will be those who will obviously try to get' you to characterize these situations so that it reinforces the argument that there was some intent in that regard. I wonder if you might be able to step back a little bit and let me begin with you, Sergeant Braun and Mr. Rolla, Are you an officer, Mr. Rolla? I didn't get your- Mr. ROLLA. Detective. Senator DODD. Detective. I'm sorry. Give us a feel for this. Obviously, You ' re being very analytical, your reports require you to do 175 so, just what the facts are, the times, the dates and what people say. I guess I should, first of all, begin by asking both of you, have you ever been involved in a suicide situation in the past? Ms. BRAUN, Yes. Senator DODD. You have, Sergeant? Ms. BRAUN, Yes. Senator DODD. So you've had some familiarity with how people react. You've had to notify a family? Ms. BRAUN. Yes, I've done notifications. Senator DODD. What normally happens? What are people like when you do that? MS. BRAUN. They're initially very upset, and then they are very inquisitive as to what happened, did the people suffer, things like that. Senator DODD. That was the case here when you went to the Foster home and, Mr. Rolla, as you say-and I appreciate entirely your job there at that point, taught and trained to go in and have to break that news- that's the toughest thing you have to do. Did Mrs. Foster and her family react in a predictable way? Mr. ROLLA. Very predictable. Traumatic. Senator DODD, Cried? Mr. ROLLA. Crying, screaming, collapsing. Senator DODD. You were there how long? About an hour; is that right? Mr. ROLLA. About an hour. Senator DODD. Hour, hour and a half, something like that? Ms. BRAUN. Hour, hour and 10 minutes. Mr. ROLLA. We got there at 10 p.m. and we cleared at 11.10, according to reports. Senator DODD. In the space of that time, it's a handful of people as you arrived and the crowd begins to gather, as I understand; is that correct? Mr. ROLLA. No other people arrived, other than the President, once we originally got there that I'm aware of. Senator DODD. So it was just, so just Ms. BRAUN. They arrived-the group arrived upon our heels of going up into the doorway, and that's the only group that came other than the President, who arrived at about 11 p.m. Senator DODD. OK. Did you talk to each individual person there, however limited, for a few minutes or less than that?