July 18, 1995 - Part 3
July 18, 1995 - Part 3
(13:00:20) Mr. HUBBELL. I have great respect for Bernie Nussbaum and his legal abilities, I really do. Bernie is one that will jump in there with both feet immediately, and that's Bernie's personality, and that's why occasionally friends of Bernie's would say, think about this. Bernie is very receptive and open, but sometimes you talk to Bernie as a friend and say don't jump in there just yet. Think about it. But Bernie is very open. I have great respect for his legal abilities. Mr. BEN-VENISTE. It has been said if Bernie Nussbaum was within 10 feet of a problem he would want to go over and snatch it and solve it. Mr. HUBBELL. That's exactly right. Mr. BEN-VENISTE. Did there come a time when you had a conversation with Phil Heymann, the Deputy Attorney General of the United States, with regard to his view of Mr. Nussbaum's involvement in coordinating law enforcement efforts? Mr. HUBBELL. Yes, I did. I believe upon my return from Little Rock, Phil and I talked about the previous week. Mr. BEN-VENISTE. Tell us, if you would, what the substance of your conversation with Mr. Nussbaum was at that time. Mr. HUBBELL. Mr. Heymann, I believe. Mr. BEN-VENISTE. Mr. Heymann, I'm sorry. Mr. HUBBELL. He told me that they had some difficulty with regard to the review of the documents in Bernie's office, that he had received a complaint from the Department of Interior and that he had to talk to Bernie, but that everything was OK. 1 had asked him did I need to talk to Bernie. He said no, everything is OK. Mr. BEN-VENISTE. Let me back up a moment and get the time sequence involved. The review of documents in Mr. Foster's office occurred on July 22, 1993? Mr. HUBBELL. That's correct. Mr. BEN-VENISTE. The funeral was on July 23, 1993? Mr. HUBBELL. That's correct. Mr. BEN-VENISTE. Your conversation with Mr. Heymann was sometime shortly after you got back to Washington? Mr. HUBBELL. I'm sure of that, because I left on the 22nd with Bernie to go home. So it was at some time-I believe I got back Monday night, so it's likely that Tuesday I talked to Phil for the first time. 60 Mr. BEN-VENISTE. In his conversation with you, did Mr. Hey- mann characterize the type of position that Bernie Nussbaum had taken vis-a-vis whether the Park Police could personally look through the documents in Mr. Foster's office? Mr. HUBBELL. Yes, he did. He described Bernie as putting his aggressive litigation hat on and that the Park Police were having difficulty with that, and that Phil had to talk to Bernie about it and resolve the issue. Mr. BEN-VENISTE. Did Mr. Heymann indicate to you whether or not he believed that Mr. Nussbaum had interfered with the inves- tigation? Mr. HUBBELL. No, he did not say that. Mr. BEN-VENISTE. In his conversation with you where he had advised you that it wouldn't be necessary for you to talk to Mr. Nussbaum, you got the impression that he thought things had settled, down and were straightened out? Mr. HUBBELL. That's correct. He said, specifically, "I've taken care of it." Mr. BEN-VENISTE. Now, you mentioned Mr. Collier, who was at the time a Chief of Staff to the Secretary of the Interior, who would have supervised the Park Police. Mr. HUBBELL. That's correct. Mr. BEN-VENISTE. Was this another Administration official in ad- dition to yourself, meaning Mr. Collier, who had a view about. whether Mr. Nussbaum was too close to Mr. Foster? Mr. HUBBELL. I really don't know that. I know Mr. Collier, know him better now than I did at that time, so I don't know what Tom's views are. Mr. BEN-VENISTE. But at this point, to bring closure to the issue, you got the impression that Mr. Heymann had heard from Mr. Collier who had expressed a view similar to yours, and that Mr. Heymann was of the view that the matter had been resolved and' things were working out? Mr. HUBBELL. Yes.