July 18, 1995 - Part 3
July 18, 1995 - Part 3
(12:35:15) Now, I've just spent a moment looking back through the depositions, and there is nothing in the depositions that factually suggests that this is how the yellow paper was found or that this is how the briefcase was held or that this is the manner in which they might even have been visible. In point of fact, the briefcase was down on the floor within reaching distance of the chair he was seated in, and he reached over and pulled out files. When those files were in there, you can't see any paper. When you pull the files out, the briefcase closes, essentially shut, like this. You can't see in it, I can't see in it, nobody could see in it. For Senator Murkowski to sit here suggesting that was a facsimile of what happened is just false, calculated to have attracted every camera in the room that turned toward that briefcase. The testimony is that Mr. Neuwirth, several days later, saw what looked to be an empty briefcase leaning up against a wall, and at that point he turned it over in putting it into a box to send back to Mrs. Foster and only several pieces of paper fell out, not all of them. There is no evidence whatsoever that the paper lined both sides, as Mr. Murkowski has demonstrated it. There is no evidence that the paper was either in one side or the other. In point of fact, the depositions say that when Mr. Neuwirth looked in there after only several pieces fell out, he had to personally remove the other pieces, which were lodged underneath the centerfold piece of this briefcase. They wouldn't move until he brought them out physically by hand. So I just think that it is a bad way to begin these hearings, with a summary that somehow suggests that the very note that everybody was looking for in order to find out what the explanation was for what happened and that every bit of testimony suggests they were struggling to find a note to give to Mrs. Foster, that all of the evidence is contrary to the demonstration that was put on here, and I think it is a calculated, inappropriate way to begin these hearings, and I think the record should show that. The CHAIRMAN. I think the record should also show that what we're engaged in now is an attempt to characterize all of the facts' I don't think that was Senator Murkowski's purpose, nor do I think that we should attempt to characterize all of the facts without giving the witnesses who have given depositions an opportunity to state when they first saw whatever they saw and the manner in which they saw it, Senator KERRY. That's what I agree with. The CHAIRMAN. So I don't intend to respond because I think what we then do is the very thing we have, I think, carefully avoided during these 3 or 4 weeks of interviews. I would say for the press, and they are the people who know, neither Democrats nor Repub- licans have been leaking depositions, putting out information, or attempting to spin. I would like to continue in that vein. Senator KERRY. Let me say, Senator, that I agree with you. said in my opening that I thought you had well set the stage and,' The CHAIRMAN. I hope we can and I'm sorry if there was any con-, fusion. I understand. I didn't know when they received that bag. They told me sometime around dinner time, about 7 p.m. If you 53 check the records, you will find that apparently there were a number of calls, not only as it related to the Foster file, but in addition to some other matters that still had not been resolved. I think the good faith that has been demonstrated so overwhelmingly and so repeatedly would mitigate toward accepting that explanation. Senator KERRY. I appreciate that. I simply say I know the Senator can't control another Senator's comments, but Senator Murkowski clearly put that in an argumentative presentational form that suggested that one could not help but have seen those papers. The CHAIRMAN. Senator, I think there will be Senator KERRY. I really would like the witnesses to testify on this matter. The CHAIRMAN. I don't want to move forward and begin to characterize other depositions that may be more supportive of one position or the other. I'm being very careful about that at this time. So why don't we move on and let's see how that line does develop, who saw what, when they saw it, and the like. But the Senator makes a point. We understand that. I think we've been doing pretty well and I would like to keep it moving in this vein of being cooperative and attempting to keep this in the vein of obtaining the facts, and that's what we've tried to do. That's why I was so appreciative of Mr. Hubbell, because I think that in his depositions-and I've read them very carefully over the 2 days that he appeared-I think he has attempted, as most of the witnesses, the vast majority, to be honest, to give the facts as they saw them, to be reasonable people. I think Senator Simon mentioned, sometimes the same people at the same event will give different interpretations of what they saw, and in an honest endeavor, Ours is to determine what those facts are, so we'll attempt to proceed in that manner.