August 4, 1994 - Part 12
August 4, 1994 - Part 12
(23:25:30) Would someone have said wait a second, I know you said, well the President appoints the head of the RTC. He serves at the pleas ure of the President, but nevertheless, lie's carrying out certain very sensitive responsibilities. And would someone have said, you know, this head of the RTC ought not to be popping in and out of here at the White House all the time? Why doesn't lie go off and do his job running the RTC? Mr. NUSSBAUM. That's right. And people should do their job running their agencies. And people-what I'm having difficulty getting across, as I watch these hearings on television in part, is people don't seem to be, to me, appreciating the notion that a person is obligated to do his duty unless he is legally or ethically required to recuse himself. Now, I think that's a fundamental principle, a significant Administration policy, and I see no problem with the White House mak. ing it clear to people, whether it's Roger Altman or Gene Ludwig who all of a sudden sua sponte decides to recuse himself because he reads a newspaper article. I do not think it is in the President's interest in his capacity as President to have a group of officials who run for cover every time some political opponent criticizes him, sends him a letter or some newspaper writes an article about him. If you have-if you are ethically or legally required to recuse yourself, and there are also rules with respect to that, do so. Do so promptly. But if you are not, you stay in your job and you do your duty and if you do not want to do your duty, you quit. You quit. You leave the Government. Senator SARBANES. Let me ask you, because I see my time is about expired here. I'm interested in Jean Hanson reporting to you on September 29 about the criminal referrals again. This was after the Waco meeting. Was it your understanding or impression that Hanson was bringing this information to you pursuant to a directive or an authorization from Altman, or was it your perception that Hanson was acting on her own in bringing this information to you? Mr. NUSSBAUM. I didn't-my answer to that, Senator Sarbanes, I just didn't think about it at the time. She didn't say she was coming pursuant to a direction from Altman. She did say, as I indicated in my testimony, that she thought Altman had sent me some material with respect to this matter previously, which was this fax that came in March of 1993, but I had no Senator SARBANES. But at the time she told you about the criminal referrals, she also told you that Altman had sent you some material about this matter before; is that correct? Mr. NUSSBAUM. That's correct. She did tell me that, which turned out to be this fax. But she didn't tell me and I didn't think whether or not she was coming at the direction of Altman. We didn't discuss it and I had no thought with regard to it at the time. Senator SARBANES. My time is up, The CHAIRMAN. Thank you, Senator Sarbanes. Senator Mack. Senator MACK. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I mean no disrespect, but I appreciate what has happened here this week, there has been some-there's some releasing of tensions and I appreciate the way you've handled yourself. I also appreciate 485 the commitment that you have to protecting the Office of the Presidency. I mean, I think that comes through very, very strongly. Mr. NUSSBAUM. That's what I was trying to do. senator MACK. And you clearly did. I really only have one question and it goes to this point: Given your knowledge of the referrals, that is that the referrals were going to be made, and your discussion with Hanson and subsequent discussions with Sloan, why would you let the President of the United States meet with Governor Tucker on October 6th?